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[ManageWP.org] Submitting new sites and flagging new articles now earn more than double karma points

Nov. 6, 2016

Three years when the site was designed we decided to give a bonus of 25 karma points when you submit an article from a site that has never been submitted (in effort to promote diversity and discovery).

Similarly when you flag an article and it gets removed you would get 5 bonus karma points.

This worked well, especially for new users who start with 100 karma points so these two activities could provide an easy karma boost early on.

As site matured, these bonus points have become less relevant relative to member's total karma. Also finding new sites has been increasingly difficult.

So today we have the following changes to the karma algorithm.

- New site submitted earns 50 bonus karma points plus 2% of members' total bonus karma points
- Article flagged and removed - 10 bonus karma points to everyone flagging the article. Additionally 1% of members' total bonus karma points to the member who flagged it first.

These changes at least double the effect and for more active members can triple or quadruple the effect. Pay attention next time you submit a new site or when an article you flag gets removed to the number of points you won - can be significant.

19 votes   Flag
Puneet Sahalot

Hi Vladimir,

Thanks for the post and changes. I had noticed recently that some members were sharing articles just to gain more traffic.
Some were sharing articles containing several affiliate links.

I hope things will get better with these changes and ManageWP will remain to be a source of the "Best" WP updates :)

Puneet S.

M Asif Rahman Ⓦ

Awesome, very logical.

Sadness, after many months I got new site discovery karma just yesterday! :S

Neil Murray

Members can and should Flag any posts that include affiliate links IMO. Everyone in the community working together can very effectively minimize & control behaviors that do not match the spirit of sharing that is dominant in this community.

Andy McIlwain

I don't see anything inherently wrong with affiliate links. They're a valid source of revenue for publishers. Problems arise when the authors don't disclose affiliate links, or when affiliate commissions influence the content in a way that's detrimental to the audience.

Ahmad Awais

That's a good move. I am not so sure about the algorithm for this site, but what I don't like is that MWP algorithm doesn't like people who post a lot, even if 99% of their posts are valid posts, community coverage and if they receive appreciation for that as well.

I think that my stats and contribution towards MWP.org is not bad. At the time of writing I have
12335 KARMA

About 300 shares and 3000+ upvotes were received. (Considering I only found out about this site in Feb 2015). Yet the MWP algorithm treats me as a spammer! At the end of 2015, I was at the 8th place, I guess, and now I am at the 12th place on the leadership board. Which is a huge factor of demotivation?

How? Well, I share and contribute more, last two posts I shared were three and four days ago. 90% of my posts get good votes (that is these posts are a much-needed news for WP community members)... while the profiles that rank higher than me on the leadership board have shared their last posts two or three months ago.

Don't get me wrong; we are all friends here, and there is no posting or ranking competition. I love data! I contribute a lot and the data being fed to this algorithm makes it like people who (after a certain amount of shares i.e. 30 to 40) stop sharing. Which is inherently against the concept of MWP. MWP is the most up to date news portal for the WP community. (For me it is). And it's algorithm doesn't like people who share more.

So, as of now, there is a price I pay for sharing everything or anything here. How? Let me tell you a vague prediction (not backed by data — ironic?)

→ Right now I have two options for 2017!

OPTION #1: Share at least four posts per month and give back/contribute my fair share to MWP to help the community and what not.
PROBABLE RESULT → Yup, if I do that, then by the end of next year I might not be there on the leadership board at all (not in the top 20). Bummer!

OPTION #2: I do NOT share anything for one complete year and just sit, watch and get the benefit from the posts being shared or from who share them (= pay the price)
PROBABLE RESULT → I might roughly end up in the top 5 to 7 users on the leadership board.

THERE! I said it!
MWP's current algorithm is broken. It favors not contributing back! It supports inactive users. Those who want to contribute pay the price.

And if anyone is thinking about responding back to this comment with "But dude, you shared that old Survey by mistake, and it got deleted, you gotta pay for that" OR "Dude stop sharing everything out there, but I do like what you share. OK now I am confused too" — twin paradox anyone?

Then let me just say, — this is just a dev's opinion and nothing else. IMHO this algorithm considers me as a spammer, and I don't like that. And as they say about opinions — they are like assholes and that everyone has one!

So, chill :) No one is pointing out any fingers, just providing honest feedback, sharing some late-night-7hours-car-drivin'-developer's frustration.

OK, that was fun. Time to sleep!


Vladimir Prelovac

You are among top 0.01% users by vote strength on the site - so you can hardly say that MWP algorithm treats you as a spammer. Maybe you have high standards (anything but first place is bad :) but just wanted to throw that reality check.

The algorithm takes into account how you spend your karma. Each time you submit an article or upvote an article, you are making a bet that it will get upvoted by others after you (as your score benefits only from votes submitted after your own). If it doesn't, it will negatively affect your overall score (which is there by design as a mechanism to 'punish' people submitting or voting on lower quality stories, their vote strength will essentially go down with time).

The inverse is true too - if every story you submit or upvote gets a lot of upvotes after you, you are guaranteed to build your vote strength fast - and that's also built into the algorithm by design.

I recommend taking a look at Omaar Osmaan's profile managewp.org/members/7506/omaar-osmaan as he came out of nowhere and managed to secure a #1 position on the leaderboard. I think it is all about submitting high quality stories and up-voting articles that are truly good. I'd like to get Omaar for an AMA one day too, curious if he found a way to game the algorithm or he is just a natural match for this website :)

ps. As explained by this discussion, discovering new sites and flagging bad articles is a great way to earn karma at a faster pace

Ahmad Awais

It makes sense. I think the word spammer was not right. But contributing more is is not favored by the algorithm. Which is bad. I do not want to just submit the best links. I want things to be organic. I want people to talk about things they normally do not want to... if that earns me bad karma so be it. More engagement should be rewarded when it is organic. Contribution is not as binary as the algo thinks it ia. just my 2 cents ;)

Vladimir Prelovac

Contributing more IS favored by the algorithm IF the stories you contribute are the kind of stories the community here wants to read.

Ahmad Awais

I think if you factor in the no. of clicks on the story shared, then the algo would be a lot more organic. It's human nature to forget and vote up the story they read, and this gets more visible when people share more stories, like you do or I do.

Vladimir Prelovac

It is also about building a brand for yourself, you should not think about the algorithm or scores but who you are and what message are you sending to the community with your contributions.

Ahmad Awais

Yes, that's exactly why I contribute. But since in this post we were talking about the algo of this site, I figured I should share what I think of it myself :)

All that said, I abs love MWP.org

Matt Medeiros

I'd like to see a "Original Content" karma ranking factor.

I submit 98% of my own content here and a majority of it gets favorable upvotes. As a content creator, it would be nice nod in our direction. Then again, I have no idea what *value* being on a leaderboard really has, short of a friendly joust. Unless you told me I could spend my Karma points on GoDaddy managed hosting. :)

Vladimir Prelovac

I'll see what I can do :)

Ahmad Awais

That'd be great!
There's no real value for being there, just people get to know that you contribute here :)